1 Confirmation with Jeff and David – Philip Silva – Bright ID and more

Bitcoin Blockchain Interviews Podcast
1 Confirmation with Jeff and David – Philip Silva – Bright ID and more

1 Confirmation Philip Silva – Bright ID and more

 Jeff: Welcome to One Confirmation with Jeff and Dave. I’m Jeff. 


Dave: I’m Dave. 


Jeff: And holy cow what a ride it’s been. Last time we talked for evering around like 10 to 12. Now Bitcoin just broke $16,000. There is no signs of the bull market coming to an end. Leading off by news, it seems like a lot of people are noticing that we’re at four times everything. Four-time trading volume, four-time difficulty, four-time pick something and we’re nowhere near the peak. 

What do you think about that Dave? 


Dave: It’s really good that it’s going great. It’s going shooting like a rocket. For the people who are trading on this, they are making really good money. On my side, I lose good money on this. Because I just sold before the election result. Then I was really like, “Oh, my God, what kind of blunder update?” 


Jeff: Yes, if I could give advice to anybody, it would be just DeFi and HODL as they say. I learned that lesson after the last rocket ride that we had going to 20K, I still had, all the way up all the way down. I’ll tell you what I did. Just because I know how I am, right. 

I bought an actual Bitcoin, physical Bitcoin Casascius coin. I bought it way back when it was $300 per Bitcoin. Put that in a vault, I don’t even have access to that vault. It doesn’t unlock for another 10 years. So, I’ll see you in about 10 years, maybe. 


So, that’s the deal. That’s how you do it. You just got to buy it, lock it up, forget about it. If this is the play you’re going to make. I would argue that it’s the plate of eight because you got the Biden administration. Well, either, right. Even if it’s a Trump administration coming on. Either way, there is only one thing they can do to fix this crazy monetary problem that we have. That’s the, print more money. By [unintelligible 2:26], and even not just me, several other economists. They said it’s going to be another $5 trillion minimum, just to keep things going. So, imagine you have a pot of $27 trillion, and you add another $5 trillion. 

What do you think happened to your money, do you think it goes up or do you think it goes down? 


Dave: Definitely money will be going down. Because you are printing more money, but the overall economy worth is the same. So definitely, it’s going down. 


Jeff: Well, joining us today, we have Phil Silva, who’s with humanity first, Bight ID, and a bunch of other projects. I came across him. So welcome to the show. Phil, can you introduce yourself? 


Philip: Yes. 

I’m Philip Silva. I work across many projects in the crypto and data space, primarily Bright ID. Which is working on the decentralized proof of personhood. I’m also a member a bunch of different DAOs. I was the founding member of the LAO, Flamingo DAO, Whaler DAO. I focus a lot on how cryptocurrency could improve the world and make things more fair and equitable and a big supporter of universal basic income and think that that should be part of what we’re doing with crypto. One of the things I want to mention is related to the numbers, we were just talking about all this money printing, if folks haven’t seen it, Demon Accuracy does some great visualizations, and they recently did an awesome video. Jeff, you should put it in the show notes. By scale, all the money that’s been printed, would like next to buildings and pushing dump trucks. You got to watch it, just to understand the scale of the money they’re printing. 


Jeff: Yes, it’s absolutely crazy. You say the words $27 trillion. And you’re like, “Okay, that’s the number I can wrap my head around.” 

But when you actually see, here’s your body, and it’s a tiny little, you can’t even see the pixel, I’m serious, you can’t even see the pixel. Then here’s $27 trillion, you’re like, “Oh, okay.” 

I think somebody else did the math. If you put the dollars side by side, it goes out to like the orbit of Mars or whatever. So, it’s insane. Along with that, you get these random people coming in and saying that, “Oh, Bitcoin is bad,” right. Well, not me. Bloomberg just recently said Bitcoin is good. So, you know there’s going to be a lot more people coming in. But that said, I think a lot of people don’t understand truly the difference that this-well, if you will, electronic money can make, right. It makes everything a lot more transparent, a lot more fair, a lot more equitable. And DAO by the way, that’s programmatic money. 

I have said it before, I’ll say it again. I’ll say it until I’m blue in the face. You combine these concepts together programmatic money, even some of the limited AI that we have. You can actually then put humans at the top of that food chain if you will. Then you no longer need to worry about money. Money becomes something that’s ego-less, right. Somebody just wrote an article most recently that said, and I will quote, 

                                    “Elon Musk is a dick.” 



It’s hilarious. But, here’s the deal. Elon Musk is absolutely narcissistic, right. And you have to be, to be a capitalist, right. How else can a capitalist exist, except as a narcissistic personality. 


Philip: No, I’m definitely an Elon supporter. I drive a Tesla. It’s the greatest car I’ve ever owned. But, no comparison. I believe that he really is going to put people on Mars. I wish he would put the Twitter down sometimes. I wish he would not feel the need to poke the SEC bear quite as much. But, the scope of what he’s doing is unbelievable. The only way you can dream that big is if you just fundamentally think differently than everybody else. Because [overlap] he’s trying to do. 


Jeff: I don’t disagree with you on his projects. I’m just talking about specifically his personality. He’s the one that decided to go after some random dude in Thailand, or whatever random region. But, that’s Elon Musk. So, that’s the thing. Capitalism doesn’t always bring out the best in people. Exhibit B, Donald Trump. So moving right along. 


There are all kinds of crazy stuff. For example, people that completely don’t understand how Monero works, right. Monero by the way, if you want privacy, I would bank on Monero. You could conceivably broadcast the Monero transaction from your own computer, and the chances of somebody spying on that transaction is infinitesimally small. You can take a couple of extra steps with a VPN or TOR or pick something. Then that risk just goes down to more atoms and then universe type of deal. 

So, some random dude came along, and you can read the article on BTC Manager about it. And said, I managed to hack Monero. 

So believe me, when I say that the Monero developers set this guy completely straight. The guy is absolute alone, and all the things he was citing, it just actually proved that the Monero system is working. [laugh] 

That’s the difference. Right now, today, if you have a bank account, and you do a transaction, the bank can shut you down at any time for any reason. Before you say, but PayPal is great, lookup, PayPal sucks. Or you say Square is great, lookup square sucks. Or you say, oh, whatever is great. I’m sure there’s a website out there, that says it sucks. That’s the point. It is a centralized system, alright. The centralized system, they spy on you, and then you’re at the behest of their morals, and whatever the morals of the day is. 

Now, don’t get me wrong. Morals are great models that necessary. But, what happens if their morals say you have to be Republican in order to do this transaction, conflict with your own. But, I’m independent. So, I can’t buy food now, is that how it works? 

Before you say that never happens. Exhibit C was over two. Hey, China. 


Philip: That will see credibly neutral systems where just anyone can transact, you don’t have to trust the other party, we can all just work together. It’s part of why I’m such a full-on the Ethereum system is that you can have all these different networks, but eventually, you’ve got to have people that don’t like or trust each other, they can still interact and they can do that. We’re going to see central bank digital currencies coming faster than anyone outside of this realm. Believe it, and I think it’s going to be huge. They’re going to be closed systems. But ultimately, I think there’s going to be a settlement among them using credibly neutral systems. 

Bitcoin in some ways, as money, but you can’t do much expressivity on Bitcoin. But, there’s loads of expressivity you can do on Ethereum. So, I think we’re going to see that network used to settle among parties that don’t want to deal with each other. 


Jeff: Well, I still go back here, I think it’s a Coke versus Pepsi. I really think that between Bitcoin and Ethereum. Bitcoin, actually, over time is adopting some of the Ethereum systems and technologies. So it maybe five or 10 years behind, but I think eventually they’ll get to where they’re at now. I happen to think that way. But meanwhile, Ethereum, you’re right, they’re on the cutting edge and they’re already getting all the cutting edge advantages where we see all these different DAOs that are coming into being proving that concept out. I think we’re barely scratching the surface of what these dials can do. I really think that and the point being, I think if you ever looking– 

I see the unemployment numbers, they’re doing this little rocket thing, right. I’m just thinking, I wish one out of 100 even these people, that small of a number 1% of those people were to go onto a website like gitcoin.co. And take one of these programming lessons. They’re free, the whole thing is free right now. 

You can download the whole programming environment on your iPad. Do a little bit of programming, and do something great. Speaking of doing something great. 

Phil, you were just talking about some of the projects you’re on, can you tell us a little bit more? 


Philip: Yes. 

The biggest one is that I focus on is Bright ID. So, Bright ID is a way to prove to an application that you exist once if one account. So, we use the terminology civil resistance. Civils is when you have a bunch of different accounts on a system. So now you’ve got 10 Twitter accounts, or you’ve got a whole bunch of bots that are playing a video game, or you’re trying to fool a digital voting system or a review site into the idea that you’re really 20 different people and really, you’re one. Bright ID is an open decentralized system that builds out a giant social graph. Just like Facebook builds out a social graph, but it’s not a company. It’s an open protocol that anybody can have access to. It’s also pseudonymous. It uses cryptography to make connections, lets anybody view that graph kind of like it. So that anyone can view a blockchain. Then different algorithms can be run on that to figure out who you believe an individual person. Then a proof from that can be given to any application. So, the application can know, hey, I’ve never seen this person before or I have seen this person before without giving them any other information. 

                        So for example, like you want to go out to the bar, they need to know that someone they trust, the DMV says you’re over 21. Instead, you hand them your license, and they’ve got your name and your address and your eye color and height. All they needed was the DMV to say, “yes, he’s good to drink.” 

So, Bright ID provides that, “yes, that’s a unique person without providing anything else.” And in many applications, that’s all something needs to know. 

It’s a universal basic income before. So one of the main use cases for Bright ID right now is there’s a project called One Hive. They have community money called, “honey,” honey is money. Anyone in the world that goes and gets verified and ready can go to the honey faucet and every two days claim their share of that day’s distribution. It’s a $1 or $2 a day worth of honey, and for a while, it was more than that. 

They’ve seen explosive growth in the last two months of people doing this, particularly in poorer countries. So where it’s worth someone’s time to go do that. So, they’ve had explosive growth in Colombia, Venezuela, and in Iran, where thousands of people are going to do this. These are brand new people to the crypto ecosystem, which is awesome. They’re going because they can get there a little bit of honey money. And all of you listeners could do that. 


Jeff: That’s amazing. I got a few questions that go along with this. solve.care, are you familiar with that particular ecosystem? 


Philip: No, never heard of it. 


Jeff: This is one of the things I’m hoping that over the next year, can help to realize the growth of these different projects. Right now, many of these projects are standalone, right. Think of all the big current DeFi systems, right. Each one stands alone and there’s a lot of duplication, right. One DeFi will have a WBTC, Rap BTC, Rap Bitcoin to Ethereum. And another one will have the exact same thing. Then they all fight each other, “oh, I’m the best or whatever.” It’s hilarious, right. Because they’re fighting over the currency of all things. There are plenty of other things to fight over. So that said, solve.care is actually trying to be at the forefront, it’s probably out of all the projects today. One of the major projects that is at the forefront of actually solving a problem, in that they’re already in operation in several different countries around the world as a Health Care System. That’s what they do, they’re health care. 

So all that crazy stuff, where you have an ID card, the very thing you mentioned, you have an ID card, you’ve had to go into your doctor and your medical records and all this. But, you mentioned the actual digital ID and along with the honey thing. 

I was thinking a couple of things. 

One, your medical ID card is one thing, but your identity card, there’s something else. I think it’d be great if there was a way to use your project in conjunction with solve.care to make sure that this person that is trying to access that medical system is that person. I think that’s a very important problem to solve. Because right now, medical step is a thing. Before you go, “no, it’s only just a couple of million dollars, it’s something know to the tune of billions.” People are pretending to be somebody else to go get $100,000 surgeries. Unfortunately, people go into bankruptcy because of it. 


Philip: definitely think. 

So, Bright ID it is very much built to be a lego that any other application can just go and grab and use. If you have the problem of, “Hey, someone should only have one account.” I would say in health care, you should only have one existence in that system. You shouldn’t have two separate health records, you should have one. Bright ID provides one really tiny piece, but it’s a foundational one. Because all it does is prove that you exist once in the system, there’s a whole lot more to identity. We often talk about self-sovereign identity. I describe that as a digital locker where you can store attestations. So you can store an attestation from your university that you graduated, you can store an attestation from the DMV which you drive, you can store an attestation that you’re a certified scuba diver, all these different attestations they store in your digital lock. 

Right now, there’s no entity on Earth, that could give you an attestation that you only exist once. That’s what Bright ID is doing. So, it’s like a really small thing, but it’s such a foundational one. Then when the user in a self-sovereign identity situation goes to try to prove something to someone that needs to hear it, they only have to give the exact pieces of information that they want to and nothing else. 


So, in the case of honey, the one Hi Faucet, they don’t want to know any information about you whatsoever. They don’t care. They just want to know that you’re getting your fair share and not more. Wow, if you go to the scuba diving place, they just need to know that you’re certified. They don’t need to know anything more. So, that’s what self-sovereign ID lets you do that should totally be part of the solid healthcare system. And all of this can be protected by cryptography and private keys which is way stronger than your username and password that you use today. 


Jeff: So, Dave, in India, do you have problems with people pretending to be other people and that sort of thing? 


Dave: Yes, that’s right. 

It’s really hard to find the identity. You may sometimes find the same people with the same identity as two people, you will find that. But, when it’s talked about the global, definitely the product that Philip is referring that to be really great. It will be more secure. Currently, in the US you have SSN in India we have [unintelligible 20:43]. But, when we talk about the global, we have nothing. 


Jeff: Right, and I think that’s the problem. I mean, somebody in India could say, hey, I’m a doctor and join some network and start giving medical care for $50 a pop and they may have no background, and all of that, right. 


Dave: Yes. 


Jeff: So how would institutions in India, do you think they’ll be ready to adopt this kind of an ID system to start certifying their doctors? 


Dave: Yes, they are. 

Because they are issuing some kind of certificate for people. They have different bodies to issue some kind of certificate, like for a doctor, there is a different body. For engineers, they have a different body, and for some other scientists, they have a different body, right for players. They’re not centralized. If I’m a doctor, and I’m also a good golf player. So, I will have two IDs. There’s no way to realize and they can tell it, okay, he’s a doctor and keep all my information safe when I move to play golf. There was it, “Okay, he’s a certified golfer and he would be our star in this game.” So yes, that’s a problem here at this moment. 


Jeff: But, here’s the beautiful thing about DAOs and how it works. I think a lot of people don’t realize how easy it is to implement something like this. So right now today, people tend to think that it’s very hard to affect change, right. Because they used to the existing stonewalling government structure, right. Right now it’s like to make a change, you have to pass or fail or whatever. That’s never going to happen because everybody’s fighting. Bills, you all hate bills, right. Especially me, I hate getting them in the mail, or email. But meanwhile, with the decentralized, autonomous organization, here’s how it works. 

                   You can by the minimum amount of tokens that are required to participate and the DAO as a governing participant. That could be as small as $0.90. We just mentioned honey is giving away $1 every two days. 


Philip: You could also earn your way into a DAO by doing by actions or you could just be granted voting shares using a system like Bright ID. Anyone is welcome to come to have a voting share. But, in some fairway. So, there are lots of ways that you do not have to buy your way with much. 


Jeff: There are lots of ways into a DAO. So yes, but specifically with Solve Care. They just require a minimum of 100 Solve Tokens in order to participate at the governing body, right, as the governing body you’re allowed to introduce, if you will legislation in the form of a here’s the proposed idea that we want to undertake. If not people vote on that idea in a thumbs-up kind of away, then that idea becomes law. 


Philip: One of my favorite things about DAO is, that if you haven’t used them, you may not understand is that in many cases that the vote that you take in a DAO is the execution of that action. So like in a really simple thing, if Dave, did some work for us, he, should be paid Dave 100 DAO for the work you did. Cool, when we vote yes, the payment immediately goes to him in the form of cryptocurrency, it doesn’t go to the accounts payable department that then cuts a cheque. So the people that make the decisions immediately, the action gets executed. That’s going to be an amazing shift in how all sorts of organizations and businesses work in the future because there’s all these administrative actions are in jobs. It’s going to displace, accounts payable does not exist in the world of DAOs. 


Jeff: I’d like to introduce one more idea that just about every health maintenance organization, that’s big pharma related, failed to do because, well, I can’t imagine why, they want more sick people for some reason. 

There’s a way to incentivize people to do healthy actions. Right now, the way they’ve been trying to incentivize people to do healthy actions, just all of it just never goes anywhere. That’s a different story for a different time. 

But, we just mentioned honey, this amazing system where people can earn honey. So imagine, if you were to combine that system, if you’re going back to combining projects together, so you can combine the digital ID system with Solve Care and come up with something even more amazing, even more trustworthy. Well, you can combine the honey system to Solve Care and incentivize people’s further living habits. So, writing your app, as you do things, for example, walk 5,000 steps, you can instantly earn some amount of honey, instantly. 

You don’t have to wait. So buyer, apple or banana, courtesy of barking 5000 steps. So that’s what I mean. All of these systems can become that much more automated, to where you don’t have to think about how you’re going to earn or live today. You can literally start to go about your life. The systems support you. Right now, I would argue in the existing fiat monetary system. Money is our master. With this cryptocurrency, we humans become the masters of our destiny. 

So what do you think Dave? 


Dave: Yes, you’re absolutely right, in the case of crypto, definitely the money will be controlled by the human. It’s not like humans will get controlled by money. The other thing I would like to add to this, which tells me the mentioned prevention care why people are encouraged to do a healthy walk. In those cases, we can also like, talk with the companies, because definitely, all the companies want to reduce their cut down their insurance costs. That could be a bigger turn for later. So, that could be the one. But yes, in case of crypto, that everything will be centralized. We know that what the employees-and we will have a history. But, whatever is needed, they can access it. That’s it. So, I think this is going to be a really great one that Philips is working on. I’m amazed by that. 


Jeff: Yes, it’s awesome stuff. 

That’s the thing. That’s why I say this is such an open field right now for any innovator to come along, spend a little bit of time a month or two building some amazing app, tying all these different things together, knocking on the doors of a company and say how would you like to give every employee $1 a day for doing the right thing. They’ll live better, they’ll earn more money, they’ll be more loyal to the company. All they have to do is download and install this app. What do you think, Phil? 


Philp: It’s great. You know, you mentioned Gitcoin before and I’m a huge supporter of Gitcoin and of the Gitcoin team. We actually integrated Bright ID we get coin in the last funding round. I ended up being the second most contributed project we made over $30,000 from that Gitcoin round, which was awesome. Thank you so much the community for supporting us. 

There is going to be a hackathon soon and we’re getting set up to be part of that hackathon and let the brilliant people in the Gitcoin ecosystem build out the next cool tool that we haven’t even thought of yet. As you sort of talk about the fact that any innovative person you just come in and build something that might be amazing. What I’m saying in that regard is even if you’re not sure exactly what it should be, come in and try something, build five lousy things, and then maybe on your sixth one, you’ll come across the right thing that actually matters. But, this is a perfect place to, to fail fast, try things along the way you’ll meet incredible people. The people in the ecosystem are just so bright and good. Find collaborators, they’ll inspire new things for you, and tend together, we can do so much more. 


Jeff: Yes, I’ve Sponsored Projects on Gitcoin as well. Actually, right now I have an open grant, but it’s probably going to be given to this guy very shortly here, the guy that I met, just improving the BTC recover Project, right. Gentleman, I know lost the password to his wallet. It’s an English password. Not one of these random passwords. So, we needed to improve the BTC Recover App, which is an open-source. This was the perfect place to find the people for it. And actually, along the way, we’re probably going to turn BTC forever into another project on Gitcoin. 

I talked to Kevin Omake, several times on the show, probably about once every six, seven months, I tried to talk to him again about what’s new and exciting. Every time I bring him on, it’s, again, exponential growth, I think one of these days, he’s probably going to be way too busy to talk to me, and like Elon Musk. 


Philip: I listened to your last episode and Kevin. He said he would come back in six months. 


Jeff: Yes, he did. 


Philip: I think he’s on the hook for that. 


Jeff: But I love the guy, honestly, he is so brilliant. That’s the thing, that’s what this space is about, you know, if you have just a passion for something, you can do that. That’s what this is about. You don’t have to be stuck in a rut. I just read there were another million people filed for unemployment most recently. I’m just thinking, “Oh, my god, there’s all these people thinking, how am I going to make it to the next meal.” There are all these things that are right now available, begging for people, honestly, to do something, something to hack something together, if you will. And by the way, that’s not necessarily a bad thing. I don’t mean hack in a bad way. I mean, like, hey, let’s put some code in to make this or that work. If even if it’s not code, there’s documentation. You can be paid, if you can even write good English or good Italian or good French or good something. 


Philip: Jeff, here’s one. So I think you have a large sort of Bitcoin audience. I would love if somebody wanted to use Bitcoin Lightning, and Bright ID to give Bitcoin to loads of people. Small amounts, like we just need a sponsor, they’d be willing to come in and give a few Bitcoin away, to thousands of people, you know, give them 10,000 SATs a piece. How cool that would be, and we could push it out into the community. So, it’s just something I would love to see. So if there are any Bitcoiners out there that want to get Bitcoin in the hands of thousands of people. Like I said, we embrace it we got this explosive growth in Venezuela, Colombia, and Iran, there are 1000 people that are already set up with their remedy. It would be pretty darn easy to set them up where there was a lightning faucet that they could go to and get a little bit of Bitcoin. Get their very first Bitcoin. So who wants to get thousands of new Bitcoiners. 

One of the reasons that I went down the road of figuring out this decentralized identity system was actually because early on in my journey, I got to sit down and have lunch with Gavin Andresen. He lives the next town over from me. It was amazing speaking to him. He ran the original Bitcoin faucet back in the day he gave away five bitcoins to anyone that came to his website. So, I dream, I would love if someone now one to pony up five Bitcoin, and instead of giving it to one person, we give it to 10,000 people. 


Jeff: Yes, I got my very first top one Bitcoin from that faucet. So thank you, Kevin. But that’s how I got my start and then learned about all this. Of course, I went through all the learning lessons that I’m sure a lot of people have gone through. I think it was in various he would go around for a time giving away the same deal, one bitcoin on paper wallets. I’m just thinking, I wonder how many of those paper wallets have disappeared. Thrown in the trash or whatever else. So, every one of those just makes all our money worth that much more, right. I would even argue that some of the originally mined bitcoins from Satoshi Nakamoto is probably lost, probably burned. 


Philip: Which is the crazy part. 


Jeff: Yes. 

I mean, think about computers and they were crashing, they were blow up, they probably reformated it, there’s probably gone. So yes, that’s the deal. That’s what that’s the space. It’s so fascinating. There are so many of these different elements. 

I was reading this article, this was not even that a lot of money. You talk about the million-dollar journey, right. It’s fun, crazy millionaire, packed a million dollars worth of whatever in some box, and started in the hills of I don’t know, Colorado or Texas or whatever. People die. People tripped over themselves. People have sued each other people have got like, 10s of thousands of people have done this for like the last five years before finally somebody found that loot and unboxed it. That was just a million dollars. Now a million Satoshi. 

On the other hand, that’s where we’re headed. By the way, a million Satoshi. If put that in a box, wait 10 years and see what happens. 


Philip: Yes. 


Jeff: Well, who is that guy that was trying to get his 100 bitcoins out of the landfill. He’s still looking for a guy. 

So what do you think, Dave, do you think people are going to be tripping over themselves, to find the Ethereums or Satoshis? 


Dave: Yes. 

Well, I’m quite fascinated with this for the last couple of months. I saw the graph, it’s going down. And then I started to think, okay, the other one, I will make more money here I’m not making much. But that mistakes people do I do the same things. I lose a lot of money. If I could have kept the same money in that Bitcoin, my money would be almost doubled now. But, now I’m losing and DeFi on this lot of different currencies. So now I’m thinking, Okay, wherever that money is, keep it, forget it and then let’s see next year. Probably next year, I will buy a car just from that. That is what I’m thinking. 


Jeff: So, I think that’s the thing. People come for the period if you will, but I think they stay for the revolution. I think that’s what it’s about. 


Philip: Yes. 

One thing about the assets I recently listened to, I listened to a lot of podcasts. And one is called uncommon core. It’s a really smart trader, and the crypto folks talk on there. They recently had on one with some traders, and they were also all former poker players, and they talk about their trading strategies, it becomes so clear that almost all of us should not be trading. The level that these guys think about this stuff, and they and they go about doing the trades, they will eat your lunch. So, what most of us should be doing is investing, not trading. I regret very few of my investments in this space. I regret many of my trades. 


Jeff: Yes, I’m with you. 


Philip: I mean, especially if you haven’t already been through multiple full cycles. Now is the time to make smart bets. Don’t be an idiot trading. I look back at some of the trades that I made in 2017. What was I thinking. 


Jeff: I’m with you. 


Philip: Invest in trade. 


Jeff: Yes, that’s a deal. 

As with any investment, I mean, even in the stock market, especially the stock market, don’t put in more than you can afford to lose. In other words, when you put it in, just think to yourself, if this goes to zero, will I be okay? And if the answer is no, put it back in your regular account, whether it be Bitcoin Ethereum, or even dollars or rupees. It doesn’t matter what it is. But, don’t invest more than you can afford to lose. That said, you’re right, be smart. If you can think five years down the line. That’s literally the horizon you should be thinking about. In other words, when you make a move, think this is a move that I’m going to park it, shut the clock for five years, lock it up, and walk away. That’s really the method or the idea for going about investing. That said, like I said, if you want to stay for the revolution, there is a whole lot of things that you can be doing, that don’t involve money at all. Just reading about the different things on BTC Manager, Gitcoin, all that that’s one thing. There are lots of podcasts that you can listen to, to learn more about what’s going on. If you pick up a few tricks of the trade setup speak, yes, there’s programming— 


Philip: Revolution. 


Jeff: Yes. 


Philip: So, the podcast that I listened to, most religiously, is the Bank List Podcast. Ryan, Sean Adams, and David Hoffman just do an amazing job. They’re now working full time. So, they’re spitting out a lot of sort of extra content that gets it can be a little much. But if you actually go back to the series for folks that like want to understand the revolution, and like how to progressively go more backward, sort of like the frontier of these new money systems, these new economic systems. They are both Bitcoin and Ethereums both of them. They do an amazing job, and anyone that really wants to understand the potential here and all the flavors, go back and start at the beginning of the Bank List Podcast series, you will not regret it. 


Jeff: Yes, that’s a good one. And any one of Andrea’s ones, there are always great for beginners, to learn about how these different things work. Don’t worry, if you don’t get it on the first go-around, that’s fine. Just go to the next topic, this space is so huge. 


Philip: No chance of getting on the first time. It’s not, nobody gets it for the first time. 


Jeff: But, I go back to my original thesis. I mean, over time, this money thing, it’s going to be just a layer. I really think 100 years from now, we’re going to look back and go, Why were they ever that obsessed about all this. It’s crazy. It’s just a language, right. 


Philip: I think some people will always be super obsessed with it. There are obscenely rich people now that still really want to make more money, it’s not that they actually need more money. They like the scoring aspect of it. If you have a billion dollars, you couldn’t spend it in your life if you wanted to. But, some of these people, want more billions, because they want a higher score. So, I don’t think that’s going to go away. Because there are always people that want a higher score. But I would love if we live in a future world where, if you don’t care about the score, that’s fine, because you’re still going to have plenty to eat and housing and, and health care and like all the things that you just need to live a happy life. And you’ve got enough money for that. That’s why I’m sort of a big advocate of UBI. Because I think that some people are worried, “Oh, people will be lazy.” 

No, I think most people if they didn’t have to worry about money, would do things that mattered to them and society will benefit. 


Jeff: Yes, [overlap] passionate. 


Philip: don’t get paid for any of the work I do on Friday. But, I do really important work for them because I care. 


Jeff: Well, it’s important to be passionate about something, right. I think people are too caught up in trying to survive, that they can’t express the thing that, they can be passionate about. I mean, either people that could be researching genetics or researching, put it this way. Somebody did the math, somebody reached out to me and figured out there was some like $1 trillion quadrillion worth of stuff in the solar system, which is a number I can’t even wrap my head around. It’s too many zeros at the end of the day, my eyes glaze over, right. But that said, I think that’s why Elan Musk is like, hey, let’s just put a couple of rockets out there. Before you say now we’d never be able to reach Mars orbit. He just parked Tesla in Mars orbit. 

I think we’re going to be getting there sooner than everybody expects. Starship is ready for launch. There’s already the guy that put together the internet. He also put together space net, if you will. So there’s even internet in space now. So, pretty soon we’ll be able to head over to Mars and head over to the asteroid belt and do mining there because why would we want to pollute our planet we can do pollution-free mining in space. 


Philip: There is an amazing article about, The Bitcoin of Mars. So, it turns out that that it’s not going to make sense to mine Bitcoin on Mars because of the distance from Earth. They did all this math to show you that like if you get a certain distance far away and Mars is beyond that line, it doesn’t make sense to mine Bitcoin. So, they did this whole article about Musk Coin. It’s basically that the Bitcoin of Mars because you should just start a new system there. Then the article goes on to explain how, if this happened, it could become an economic reason to settle new places in the universe. Because if you get there and you can set up in the new base. So based on Bitcoin, that you can create a new monetary system, the only way you can do it is to establish those like frontier planets. That’s a great article. 


Jeff: Yes, definitely one I think I’ll enjoy reading. So, that’s the thing. The space face is so huge. So let’s definitely work at it rather than trying to struggle to survive, there’s plenty of things that can be done, to even be paid to learn. Some 17-year-old students and India can make $1 a day or more and learn Ethereum in solidity programming, and to create any one of these amazing innovations that will just move all of humanity forward. That’s what it’s all about. 

Well, any last thoughts? It’s been a great show. Enjoy talking to you both, Dave and Philip. Any last thoughts, Philip? 


Philip: I just want to give a shout out to that article. I just dropped you the link in the chat. So, you can put in the show notes. It’s called Bitcoin Astronomy It Was On Unchained Capital. I don’t know how to pronounce his name. Drew Bansal, and you got to read it. It’s a way to think about Bitcoin, as it goes beyond the borders of the earth, which is a pretty amazing thought. 


Jeff: That’s going to be awesome. 

Dave, any last thoughts? 


Dave: From this meeting, this discussion, I learned one very important thing is like this is a resolution period. Don’t trade. Just invest if you have, and that’s it. So in the future, your future is going to be really good. If you invest. If you start trading, then you will be stuck in very minor things you won’t think of as big. 


Jeff: Indeed. 

So that’s the deal. Come for the fear stay for the revolution. 

It’s been an amazing show. It’s been great to have you all, and I look forward to the next podcast. Philip, thank you for being here. It was great to have you. I would love to check in with you about six or seven months down the line just to see how things are going. I’ll definitely follow your project. I would encourage all of our listeners to check out Philip’s work. Do you want to tell us what the links are, and how to get there. 


Philip: That’s brightid.org will be the main project website. We’re on Twitter at @brightidproject. I’m on Twitter @UBIpromoter. 


Jeff: Awesome. 

And, again, I’m Jeff. 


Dave: And I’m Dave. 

It was great to have you. 

Thank you.


Aisshwarya Tiwari

Aisshwarya is currently working as the Chief Editor at crypto.news and holds more than 4 years of experience in the digital assets industry. He holds an undergraduate degree in Commerce with Honours and a post-graduate diploma in Liberal Studies. Before entering the crypto industry, Aisshwarya worked as an SAP Consultant for a global IT firm. He also cleared the CFA Level 1 exam before pivoting to the crypto industry due to its novel and exciting propositions.